Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Daniel-25
At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is send back to the texture in OpenSim.

I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart from picidae.net and get independent. For me, it is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.


-DAniel


2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]>

> >
> > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about that and
> > I
> > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me with the
> > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> >
> > -Robert
> >
> >
> > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
>  
>> > >
>> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix
>> > > server"
>> > >
>> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
>> > >
>> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
>>    
>>> > >> Hey Charles,
>>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in realtime like the
>>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page on a prim"
>>> > >> boards using picidai.net running on my company's internal opensim, but
>>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well what we have
>>>      
> > in
>  
>>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the ability to at
>>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it updating is
>>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to interact with that
>>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
>>>      
> > functionality,
>  
>>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to go the
>>>      
> > route
>  
>>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus different
>>>      
> > users
>  
>>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in opensim/hippo?
>>> > >>
>>> > >> -Robert
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
>>>      
>>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a characteristic of the
>>>> > >> > client.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is displaying web
>>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping web site for
>>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the OSGrid forums
>>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages on a prim is
>>>>        
>>> > >> on
>>>      
>>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Charles
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > ________________________________
>>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]>
>>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
>>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
>>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>>>> > >> > pages?
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a prim, but what
>>>> > >> > about
>>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in the next 3
>>>>        
> > -
>  
>>> > >> 6
>>>      
>>>> > >> > months?
>>>>        
>>> > >>
>>>      
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>> > > [hidden email]
>> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>> > >
>> > >
>>    
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>  
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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Fish_Kungfu
Daniel...

Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet (opencroquet.org).  Open Croquet is another 3D world development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative" (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly the zip file link didn't work for me.

Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose chase.  :-)

~~Fish~~


On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]> wrote:
At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is send back to the texture in OpenSim.

I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart from picidae.net and get independent. For me, it is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.


-DAniel


2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]>

> >
> > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about that and
> > I
> > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me with the
> > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> >
> > -Robert
> >
> >
> > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
>
>> > >
>> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix
>> > > server"
>> > >
>> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
>> > >
>> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
>>
>>> > >> Hey Charles,
>>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in realtime like the
>>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page on a prim"
>>> > >> boards using picidai.net running on my company's internal opensim, but
>>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well what we have
>>>
> > in
>
>>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the ability to at
>>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it updating is
>>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to interact with that
>>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
>>>
> > functionality,
>
>>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to go the
>>>
> > route
>
>>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus different
>>>
> > users
>
>>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in opensim/hippo?
>>> > >>
>>> > >> -Robert
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
>>>
>>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a characteristic of the
>>>> > >> > client.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is displaying web
>>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping web site for
>>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the OSGrid forums
>>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages on a prim is
>>>>
>>> > >> on
>>>
>>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Charles
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > ________________________________
>>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]>
>>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
>>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
>>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>>>> > >> > pages?
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a prim, but what
>>>> > >> > about
>>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in the next 3
>>>>
> > -
>
>>> > >> 6
>>>
>>>> > >> > months?
>>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>> > > [hidden email]
>> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>> > >
>> > >
>>
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>
_______________________________________________
Opensim-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users



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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Olli Aro
Administrator

Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but cannot see why it would not also work there.

 

The link to that project is here:

 

http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php

 

Regards,

 

Olli

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fish Kungfu
Sent: 16 September 2009 12:05
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web

 

Daniel...

Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet (opencroquet.org).  Open Croquet is another 3D world development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative" (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly the zip file link didn't work for me.

Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose chase.  :-)

~~Fish~~

On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]> wrote:

At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is send back to the texture in OpenSim.

I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart from picidae.net and get independent. For me, it is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.


-DAniel


2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]>

> >
> > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about that and
> > I
> > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me with the
> > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> >
> > -Robert
> >
> >
> > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
>
>> > >
>> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix
>> > > server"
>> > >
>> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
>> > >
>> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
>>
>>> > >> Hey Charles,
>>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in realtime like the
>>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page on a prim"
>>> > >> boards using picidai.net running on my company's internal opensim, but
>>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well what we have
>>>
> > in
>
>>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the ability to at
>>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it updating is
>>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to interact with that
>>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
>>>
> > functionality,
>
>>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to go the
>>>
> > route
>
>>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus different
>>>
> > users
>
>>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in opensim/hippo?
>>> > >>
>>> > >> -Robert
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
>>>
>>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a characteristic of the
>>>> > >> > client.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is displaying web
>>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping web site for
>>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the OSGrid forums
>>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages on a prim is
>>>>
>>> > >> on
>>>
>>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Charles
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > ________________________________
>>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]>
>>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
>>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
>>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>>>> > >> > pages?
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a prim, but what
>>>> > >> > about
>>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in the next 3
>>>>
> > -
>
>>> > >> 6
>>>
>>>> > >> > months?
>>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>> > > [hidden email]
>> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>> > >
>> > >
>>
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>
_______________________________________________
Opensim-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users




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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Daniel-25
In reply to this post by Daniel-25
Thanks for your links. The idea of my solution is to improve the virtual
browser from the Sloodle project. They use a virtual mouse for
navigation on their texture. My idea is to use the desktop mouse instead
of a virtual mouse to improve the handling and controlling of the
virtual browser. With the help of the script function
"lldetectedTouchUV()" it is possible to get the coordinates of the mouse
device when a user clicks on a texture. With that help it is no problem
to detect if a link on a webpage is selected or not (or something
similar). That's the main difference between my implementation and the
webbrowser control of the Sloodle project. Furthermore, I think that the
sloodle community wants to integrate their concepts into OpenSim, but
I'm not sure about their current status. It seems to me that it is not
that easy to get it work into OpenSim. If there is anybody who could
spend a little time to give it a try or to get some more information
about that I would be happy to hear something about that. Within the
world of Croquet you can realize co-browsing, app-sharing and direct
connection between different worlds. Some months ago, I've downloaded
Croquet to get an idea how it works, but with no success. For me, it's
an secret how they realize their "gates" in world and if it is possible
to get something similar working in OpenSim. If we could so, a few
problems would be done. Until then I'm trying to improve my solution to
get it work, since there are some tiny problems. If I get something new
I will tell you ;-) --- Daniel From: "Olli Aro" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
To: <[hidden email]> Message-ID:
<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAJvPto8dXaJNqufVsxzMG9DCgAAAEAAAAG70B0f7nAFOg/rrUZFtVmUBAAAAAA==@yahoo.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sloodle project also has
something similar. Initially that is developed for Second Life (and I
have not tested it in OpenSim), but cannot see why it would not also
work there. The link to that project is here:
http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php Regards, Olli From:
[hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fish Kungfu
Sent: 16 September 2009 12:05 To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
Daniel... Glad to hear you are working on this. I searched the OpenSim
email archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet
(opencroquet.org). Open Croquet is another 3D world development
environment. The only reason I mention it is because it says on their
site they they support in-world web-browsing and I thought you might get
some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've done (without violating
their licensing etc). The in-world web browsing is accomplished via a
module called "Croquet Collaborative"
(http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative). Sadly the
zip file link didn't work for me. Anyways, I hope this helps some,
without sending you on a wild goose chase. :-) ~~Fish~~ On Wed, Sep 16,
2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]> wrote: At the moment, I'm trying
to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim by integrating a webbrowser
control. With the help of that control the user would be able to
interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by sending the coordinates
of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an instance of the Internet
Explorer running in the background could be used with these coords to
manage different user interactions like link forwarding or editing form
fields. As a result the updated webpage is rendered with the
IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is send back to the
texture in OpenSim. I know that this solution is limited in various ways
(and is not compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to
go apart from picidae.net and get independent. For me, it is a first
step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim. -DAniel
2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]>

>> > >
>> > > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about that
>>    
and

>> > > I
>> > > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me with
>>    
the

>> > > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
>> > >
>> > > -Robert
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
>>    
> >
>  
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not running on
>>>>        
a*nix

>>>> >> > > server"
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > It does run fine on linux servers.   :-)
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
>>>>        
>> >>
>>    
>>>>>> >>> > >> Hey Charles,
>>>>>> >>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in realtime
>>>>>>            
like the

>>>>>> >>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page on a
>>>>>>            
prim"

>>>>>> >>> > >> boards using picidai.net running on my company's internal opensim,
>>>>>>            
but

>>>>>> >>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well what we
>>>>>>            
have

>>> >>>
>>>      
>> > > in
>>    
> >
>  
>>>>>> >>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the ability
>>>>>>            
to at

>>>>>> >>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it updating
>>>>>>            
is

>>>>>> >>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to interact with
>>>>>>            
that

>>>>>> >>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
>>>>>> >>> > >>
>>>>>> >>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>> > > functionality,
>>    
> >
>  
>>>>>> >>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to go the
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>> > > route
>>    
> >
>  
>>>>>> >>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus different
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>> > > users
>>    
> >
>  
>>>>>> >>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
>>>>>> >>> > >>
>>>>>> >>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in
>>>>>>            
opensim/hippo?

>>>>>> >>> > >>
>>>>>> >>> > >> -Robert
>>>>>> >>> > >>
>>>>>> >>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a characteristic
>>>>>>>>                
of the

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > client.
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is
>>>>>>>>                
displaying web

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping web site
>>>>>>>>                
for

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net.
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the OSGrid
>>>>>>>>                
forums

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages on a
>>>>>>>>                
prim is

>>>> >>>>
>>>>        
>>>>>> >>> > >> on
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > Charles
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > ________________________________
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]>
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of
>>>>>>>>                
web

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > pages?
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> >
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a prim, but
>>>>>>>>                
what

>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > about
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in the
>>>>>>>>                
next 3

>>>> >>>>
>>>>        
>> > > -
>>    
> >
>  
>>>>>> >>> > >> 6
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>>>>>>>> >>>> > >> > months?
>>>>>>>>                
>>>> >>>>
>>>>        
>>>>>> >>> > >>
>>>>>>            
>>> >>>
>>>      
>>>> >> > > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>>>> >> > > [hidden email]
>>>> >> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>> >> > >
>>>> >> > >
>>>>        
>> >>
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > View this message in context:
>> > >
>>    
http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626
144p3638764.html

>> > > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>> > > [hidden email]
>> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>> > >
>>    
> >
>  
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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Charles Krinke-3
In reply to this post by Olli Aro
Folks have been using SLoodle off and on with OpenSim and on OSGrid for some months now. There have been some interesting building classes at "Sandbox Plaza" using SLoodle so I think it is fairly far along.

As far as OpenCroquet, I would encourage folks to find ways for us to interop between OpenSim and OpenCroquet. It would be really cool to be able to view an OpenCroquet space from a prim on an OpenSim region or ideally to be able to step through a gateway some time.

Charles


From: Olli Aro <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:09:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web

Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but cannot see why it would not also work there.

 

The link to that project is here:

 

http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php

 

Regards,

 

Olli

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fish Kungfu
Sent: 16 September 2009 12:05
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web

 

Daniel...

Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet (opencroquet.org).  Open Croquet is another 3D world development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative" (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly the zip file link didn't work for me.

Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose chase.  :-)

~~Fish~~

On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]> wrote:

At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is send back to the texture in OpenSim.

I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart from picidae.net and get independent. For me, it is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.


-DAniel


2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]>

> >
> > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about that and
> > I
> > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me with the
> > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> >
> > -Robert
> >
> >
> > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
>
>> > >
>> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix
>> > > server"
>> > >
>> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
>> > >
>> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
>>
>>> > >> Hey Charles,
>>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in realtime like the
>>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page on a prim"
>>> > >> boards using picidai.net running on my company's internal opensim, but
>>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well what we have
>>>
> > in
>
>>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the ability to at
>>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it updating is
>>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to interact with that
>>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
>>>
> > functionality,
>
>>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to go the
>>>
> > route
>
>>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus different
>>>
> > users
>
>>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in opensim/hippo?
>>> > >>
>>> > >> -Robert
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
>>>
>>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a characteristic of the
>>>> > >> > client.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is displaying web
>>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping web site for
>>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the OSGrid forums
>>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages on a prim is
>>>>
>>> > >> on
>>>
>>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Charles
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > ________________________________
>>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]>
>>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
>>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
>>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>>>> > >> > pages?
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a prim, but what
>>>> > >> > about
>>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in the next 3
>>>>
> > -
>
>>> > >> 6
>>>
>>>> > >> > months?
>>>>
>>> > >>
>>>
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Opensim-users mailing list
>> > > [hidden email]
>> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>> > >
>> > >
>>
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>
_______________________________________________
Opensim-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users




--
... . - . -.-. / .- ... - .-. --- -. --- -- -.--


_______________________________________________
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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Toni Alatalo
Charles Krinke kirjoitti:
> As far as OpenCroquet, I would encourage folks to find ways for us to
> interop between OpenSim and OpenCroquet. It would be really cool to be
> able to view an OpenCroquet space from a prim on an OpenSim region or
> ideally to be able to step through a gateway some time.

BTW, I wrote a little web server plugin to the Naali (new rex) viewer
this autumn, to serve live screenshots and perhaps video to outside: to
a web page, or to be a texture on some object anywhere else. There's a
screenshot and a link to the source (in viewer trunk) in
http://wiki.realxtend.org/index.php/Naali_webserver_plugin

So if someone has a spare machine that can keep running a viewer
connected to some region on e.g. osgrid, we could put a live image e.g.
on the opensimulator.org web page :) .. Naali doesn't have LOD
optimizations yet, so for a complex region like Wright Plaza you need a
powerful gfx card .. but simple regions work on weak cards, even Intel
integrated etc. (basically anything where Ogre runs, and it runs pretty
much everywhere). People (e.g. Ryan/sempuki) have now been using Naali
succesfully on Linux too.

The idea is that by having the web server plugin running inside the
viewer, it is easy to expose viewer things like controlling the camera
to some web ui - that's not done yet, feel free to expand, anyone. There
are some calls for cam and avatar control in the API ready for use, just
need to add some html buttons to the ui (and I guess ajax would be the
way). This is not a feature that was planned, but just happened to be
low hanging fruit 'cause the event framework we've used came with a web
server too, so I wanted to test it.

Is fun to be able to provide a view, even a controllable one, to anyone
on the web without any plugins or anything. Limitations of the viewer of
course apply, like right now you still see every avatar as the viewer
default avatar, but that's already changing :)

> Charles

~Toni


>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Olli Aro <[hidden email]>
> *To:* [hidden email]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:09:19 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>
> Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is
> developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but
> cannot see why it would not also work there.
>
>  
>
> The link to that project is here:
>
>  
>
> http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php
>
>  
>
> Regards,
>
>  
>
> Olli
>
>  
>
> *From:* [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] *On Behalf Of *Fish Kungfu
> *Sent:* 16 September 2009 12:05
> *To:* [hidden email]
> *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>
>  
>
> Daniel...
>
> Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email
> archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet (opencroquet.org
> <http://opencroquet.org>).  Open Croquet is another 3D world
> development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it
> says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I
> thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've
> done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web
> browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative"
> (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly
> the zip file link didn't work for me.
>
> Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose
> chase.  :-)
>
> ~~Fish~~
>
> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
> At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim
> by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the
> user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by
> sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an
> instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be
> used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link
> forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is
> rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is
> send back to the texture in OpenSim.
>
> I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not
> compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart
> from picidae.net <http://picidae.net> and get independent. For me, it
> is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.
>
>
> -DAniel
>
>
> 2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
>
> > >
> > > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about
> that and
> > > I
> > > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me
> with the
> > > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> > >
> > > -Robert
> > >
> > >
> > > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
> >
> >> > >
> >> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not
> running on a*nix
> >> > > server"
> >> > >
> >> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
> >> > >
> >> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
> >>
> >>> > >> Hey Charles,
> >>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in
> realtime like the
> >>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page
> on a prim"
> >>> > >> boards using picidai.net <http://picidai.net> running on my
> company's internal opensim, but
> >>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well
> what we have
> >>>
> > > in
> >
> >>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the
> ability to at
> >>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it
> updating is
> >>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to
> interact with that
> >>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
> >>> > >>
> >>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
> >>>
> > > functionality,
> >
> >>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to
> go the
> >>>
> > > route
> >
> >>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus
> different
> >>>
> > > users
> >
> >>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
> >>> > >>
> >>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in
> opensim/hippo?
> >>> > >>
> >>> > >> -Robert
> >>> > >>
> >>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a
> characteristic of the
> >>>> > >> > client.
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is
> displaying web
> >>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping
> web site for
> >>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net <http://picidai.net>.
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the
> OSGrid forums
> >>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages
> on a prim is
> >>>>
> >>> > >> on
> >>>
> >>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> > Charles
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> > ________________________________
> >>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> >>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>
> >>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
> >>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the
> display of web
> >>>> > >> > pages?
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> >
> >>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a
> prim, but what
> >>>> > >> > about
> >>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in
> the next 3
> >>>>
> > > -
> >
> >>> > >> 6
> >>>
> >>>> > >> > months?
> >>>>
> >>> > >>
> >>>
> >> > > _______________________________________________
> >> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> >> > > [hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>
> >> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >>
> > >
> > > --
> > > View this message in context:
> > >
> http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com
> <http://Nabble.com>.
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > > [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
>
>
>
> --
> ... . - . -.-. / .- ... - .-. --- -. --- -- -.--
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>  

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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Olli Aro
Administrator
Hi all,

Just discovered that if you do use the Second Life viewer with your OpenSim
then you just need to set AutoMimeDiscovery to 1 in settings.xml and web
content works!!!

Regards,

Olli

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
> [hidden email]] On Behalf Of Toni Alatalo
> Sent: 17 September 2009 07:31
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
>
> Charles Krinke kirjoitti:
> > As far as OpenCroquet, I would encourage folks to find ways for us to
> > interop between OpenSim and OpenCroquet. It would be really cool to
> be
> > able to view an OpenCroquet space from a prim on an OpenSim region or
> > ideally to be able to step through a gateway some time.
>
> BTW, I wrote a little web server plugin to the Naali (new rex) viewer
> this autumn, to serve live screenshots and perhaps video to outside: to
> a web page, or to be a texture on some object anywhere else. There's a
> screenshot and a link to the source (in viewer trunk) in
> http://wiki.realxtend.org/index.php/Naali_webserver_plugin
>
> So if someone has a spare machine that can keep running a viewer
> connected to some region on e.g. osgrid, we could put a live image e.g.
> on the opensimulator.org web page :) .. Naali doesn't have LOD
> optimizations yet, so for a complex region like Wright Plaza you need a
> powerful gfx card .. but simple regions work on weak cards, even Intel
> integrated etc. (basically anything where Ogre runs, and it runs pretty
> much everywhere). People (e.g. Ryan/sempuki) have now been using Naali
> succesfully on Linux too.
>
> The idea is that by having the web server plugin running inside the
> viewer, it is easy to expose viewer things like controlling the camera
> to some web ui - that's not done yet, feel free to expand, anyone.
> There
> are some calls for cam and avatar control in the API ready for use,
> just
> need to add some html buttons to the ui (and I guess ajax would be the
> way). This is not a feature that was planned, but just happened to be
> low hanging fruit 'cause the event framework we've used came with a web
> server too, so I wanted to test it.
>
> Is fun to be able to provide a view, even a controllable one, to anyone
> on the web without any plugins or anything. Limitations of the viewer
> of
> course apply, like right now you still see every avatar as the viewer
> default avatar, but that's already changing :)
>
> > Charles
>
> ~Toni
>
>
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
> > *From:* Olli Aro <[hidden email]>
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:09:19 AM
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of
> web
> >
> > Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is
> > developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but
> > cannot see why it would not also work there.
> >
> >
> >
> > The link to that project is here:
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> >
> >
> > Olli
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* [hidden email]
> > [mailto:[hidden email]] *On Behalf Of *Fish
> Kungfu
> > *Sent:* 16 September 2009 12:05
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of
> web
> >
> >
> >
> > Daniel...
> >
> > Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email
> > archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet
> (opencroquet.org
> > <http://opencroquet.org>).  Open Croquet is another 3D world
> > development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it
> > says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I
> > thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what
> they've
> > done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web
> > browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative"
> > (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly
> > the zip file link didn't work for me.
> >
> > Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose
> > chase.  :-)
> >
> > ~~Fish~~
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> >
> > At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of
> OpenSim
> > by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control
> the
> > user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by
> > sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an
> > instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be
> > used with these coords to manage different user interactions like
> link
> > forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is
> > rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is
> > send back to the texture in OpenSim.
> >
> > I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not
> > compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart
> > from picidae.net <http://picidae.net> and get independent. For me, it
> > is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.
> >
> >
> > -DAniel
> >
> >
> > 2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> >
> > > >
> > > > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought
> about
> > that and
> > > > I
> > > > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me
> > with the
> > > > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend
> justice.
> > > >
> > > > -Robert
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not
> > running on a*nix
> > >> > > server"
> > >> > >
> > >> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> > >> Hey Charles,
> > >>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in
> > realtime like the
> > >>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web
> page
> > on a prim"
> > >>> > >> boards using picidai.net <http://picidai.net> running on my
> > company's internal opensim, but
> > >>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well
> > what we have
> > >>>
> > > > in
> > >
> > >>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the
> > ability to at
> > >>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it
> > updating is
> > >>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to
> > interact with that
> > >>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
> > >>>
> > > > functionality,
> > >
> > >>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to
> > go the
> > >>>
> > > > route
> > >
> > >>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus
> > different
> > >>>
> > > > users
> > >
> > >>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different
> experiences.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in
> > opensim/hippo?
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> -Robert
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a
> > characteristic of the
> > >>>> > >> > client.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is
> > displaying web
> > >>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping
> > web site for
> > >>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net
> <http://picidai.net>.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the
> > OSGrid forums
> > >>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages
> > on a prim is
> > >>>>
> > >>> > >> on
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a
> year.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > Charles
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > ________________________________
> > >>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> > >>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > >>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
> > >>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the
> > display of web
> > >>>> > >> > pages?
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a
> > prim, but what
> > >>>> > >> > about
> > >>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening
> in
> > the next 3
> > >>>>
> > > > -
> > >
> > >>> > >> 6
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > months?
> > >>>>
> > >>> > >>
> > >>>
> > >> > > _______________________________________________
> > >> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > >> > > [hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > >> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >>
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > View this message in context:
> > > >
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-
> pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > > > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com
> > <http://Nabble.com>.
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > > > [hidden email] <mailto:Opensim-
> [hidden email]>
> > > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > > >
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email] <mailto:Opensim-
> [hidden email]>
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ... . - . -.-. / .- ... - .-. --- -. --- -- -.--
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users

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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Chris Hart
I did a blog post about this a while back, and it does indeed get the
viewer displaying web content on a prim like on SL:

http://www.reactiongrid.com/default/blogzone/ninjablog/09-04-11/Web_page
_textures_on_a_prim.aspx

It works to a point - you get to see web pages on prims, but there is a
catch - I had trouble after making that change in viewing streaming
media, and others had similar issues. It seems the autodetect code in
the client is not clever enough.

The better solution is to get mime types communicated between the
OpenSim server and the client. I looked into this once before and it was
somewhat tricky to unravel where the communications went (there was some
LibOpenMetaverse involvement).

Chris


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Olli Aro
Sent: 17 September 2009 08:19
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web

Hi all,

Just discovered that if you do use the Second Life viewer with your
OpenSim
then you just need to set AutoMimeDiscovery to 1 in settings.xml and web
content works!!!

Regards,

Olli

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
> [hidden email]] On Behalf Of Toni Alatalo
> Sent: 17 September 2009 07:31
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of
web
>
> Charles Krinke kirjoitti:
> > As far as OpenCroquet, I would encourage folks to find ways for us
to
> > interop between OpenSim and OpenCroquet. It would be really cool to
> be
> > able to view an OpenCroquet space from a prim on an OpenSim region
or
> > ideally to be able to step through a gateway some time.
>
> BTW, I wrote a little web server plugin to the Naali (new rex) viewer
> this autumn, to serve live screenshots and perhaps video to outside:
to
> a web page, or to be a texture on some object anywhere else. There's a
> screenshot and a link to the source (in viewer trunk) in
> http://wiki.realxtend.org/index.php/Naali_webserver_plugin
>
> So if someone has a spare machine that can keep running a viewer
> connected to some region on e.g. osgrid, we could put a live image
e.g.
> on the opensimulator.org web page :) .. Naali doesn't have LOD
> optimizations yet, so for a complex region like Wright Plaza you need
a
> powerful gfx card .. but simple regions work on weak cards, even Intel
> integrated etc. (basically anything where Ogre runs, and it runs
pretty

> much everywhere). People (e.g. Ryan/sempuki) have now been using Naali
> succesfully on Linux too.
>
> The idea is that by having the web server plugin running inside the
> viewer, it is easy to expose viewer things like controlling the camera
> to some web ui - that's not done yet, feel free to expand, anyone.
> There
> are some calls for cam and avatar control in the API ready for use,
> just
> need to add some html buttons to the ui (and I guess ajax would be the
> way). This is not a feature that was planned, but just happened to be
> low hanging fruit 'cause the event framework we've used came with a
web
> server too, so I wanted to test it.
>
> Is fun to be able to provide a view, even a controllable one, to
anyone

> on the web without any plugins or anything. Limitations of the viewer
> of
> course apply, like right now you still see every avatar as the viewer
> default avatar, but that's already changing :)
>
> > Charles
>
> ~Toni
>
>
> >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
> > *From:* Olli Aro <[hidden email]>
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:09:19 AM
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display
of

> web
> >
> > Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is
> > developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but
> > cannot see why it would not also work there.
> >
> >
> >
> > The link to that project is here:
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> >
> >
> > Olli
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* [hidden email]
> > [mailto:[hidden email]] *On Behalf Of *Fish
> Kungfu
> > *Sent:* 16 September 2009 12:05
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display
of

> web
> >
> >
> >
> > Daniel...
> >
> > Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email
> > archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet
> (opencroquet.org
> > <http://opencroquet.org>).  Open Croquet is another 3D world
> > development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it
> > says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I
> > thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what
> they've
> > done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web
> > browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative"
> > (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly
> > the zip file link didn't work for me.
> >
> > Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose
> > chase.  :-)
> >
> > ~~Fish~~
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> >
> > At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of
> OpenSim
> > by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control
> the
> > user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture
by
> > sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore,
an
> > instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be
> > used with these coords to manage different user interactions like
> link
> > forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage
is
> > rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is
> > send back to the texture in OpenSim.
> >
> > I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not
> > compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart
> > from picidae.net <http://picidae.net> and get independent. For me,
it

> > is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.
> >
> >
> > -DAniel
> >
> >
> > 2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> >
> > > >
> > > > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought
> about
> > that and
> > > > I
> > > > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves
me

> > with the
> > > > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend
> justice.
> > > >
> > > > -Robert
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not
> > running on a*nix
> > >> > > server"
> > >> > >
> > >> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> > >> Hey Charles,
> > >>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in
> > realtime like the
> > >>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web
> page
> > on a prim"
> > >>> > >> boards using picidai.net <http://picidai.net> running on my
> > company's internal opensim, but
> > >>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well
> > what we have
> > >>>
> > > > in
> > >
> > >>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the
> > ability to at
> > >>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it
> > updating is
> > >>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to
> > interact with that
> > >>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
> > >>>
> > > > functionality,
> > >
> > >>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want
to

> > go the
> > >>>
> > > > route
> > >
> > >>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus
> > different
> > >>>
> > > > users
> > >
> > >>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different
> experiences.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in
> > opensim/hippo?
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> -Robert
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a
> > characteristic of the
> > >>>> > >> > client.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is
> > displaying web
> > >>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping
> > web site for
> > >>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net
> <http://picidai.net>.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the
> > OSGrid forums
> > >>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages
> > on a prim is
> > >>>>
> > >>> > >> on
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a
> year.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > Charles
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > ________________________________
> > >>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> > >>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > >>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
> > >>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the
> > display of web
> > >>>> > >> > pages?
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a
> > prim, but what
> > >>>> > >> > about
> > >>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening
> in
> > the next 3
> > >>>>
> > > > -
> > >
> > >>> > >> 6
> > >>>
> > >>>> > >> > months?
> > >>>>
> > >>> > >>
> > >>>
> > >> > > _______________________________________________
> > >> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > >> > > [hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > >> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >>
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > View this message in context:
> > > >
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-
> pages-tp3626144p3638764.html
> > > > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com
> > <http://Nabble.com>.
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > > > [hidden email] <mailto:Opensim-
> [hidden email]>
> > > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > > >
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email] <mailto:Opensim-
> [hidden email]>
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ... . - . -.-. / .- ... - .-. --- -. --- -- -.--
> >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------

> ---
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users

_______________________________________________
Opensim-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Daniel-25
In reply to this post by Daniel-25
Thanks a lot for that post, Chris. I'm looking for that solution very, very long and I wondered why I didn't get streaming media to work in OpenSim although it works in Second Life. But now I know why :)

By the way, is there a possibility to update the flash player plugin in the Hippo Viewer to enable playback of current videos hosted on youtube? For me the Viewer complains that the flash player plugin seems to be to old. Is there any chance to update?


-Daniel


I did a blog post about this a while back, and it does indeed get the
viewer displaying web content on a prim like on SL:

http://www.reactiongrid.com/default/blogzone/ninjablog/09-04-11/Web_page
_textures_on_a_prim.aspx

It works to a point - you get to see web pages on prims, but there is a
catch - I had trouble after making that change in viewing streaming
media, and others had similar issues. It seems the autodetect code in
the client is not clever enough.

The better solution is to get mime types communicated between the
OpenSim server and the client. I looked into this once before and it was
somewhat tricky to unravel where the communications went (there was some
LibOpenMetaverse involvement).

Chris

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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Chris Hart
There is no plugin in the viewer - the LL client's built in browser,
based on FireFox2 I believe, is completely cut down to zero plugins. And
while it could be possible to update this embedded browser if you have a
developer handy who can re-engineer the client, it's not a trivial task.


There is a way to get youtube videos streaming inworld and I think it
involves finding a link for a mobile-compatible video link, and can be
hit-and-miss. Others may have more info.


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Daniel
Sent: 17 September 2009 22:39
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web

Thanks a lot for that post, Chris. I'm looking for that solution very,
very long and I wondered why I didn't get streaming media to work in
OpenSim although it works in Second Life. But now I know why :)

By the way, is there a possibility to update the flash player plugin in
the Hippo Viewer to enable playback of current videos hosted on youtube?
For me the Viewer complains that the flash player plugin seems to be to
old. Is there any chance to update?


-Daniel


I did a blog post about this a while back, and it does indeed get the
viewer displaying web content on a prim like on SL:

http://www.reactiongrid.com/default/blogzone/ninjablog/09-04-11/Web_page
_textures_on_a_prim.aspx

It works to a point - you get to see web pages on prims, but there is a
catch - I had trouble after making that change in viewing streaming
media, and others had similar issues. It seems the autodetect code in
the client is not clever enough.

The better solution is to get mime types communicated between the
OpenSim server and the client. I looked into this once before and it was
somewhat tricky to unravel where the communications went (there was some
LibOpenMetaverse involvement).

Chris

_______________________________________________
Opensim-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.91/2363 - Release Date:
09/17/09 06:18:00
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Re: Any plans on supporting the display of web

Jeroen van Veen
In reply to this post by Toni Alatalo
what's the current status of awesomium in the new rexviewer? awesomium would
be a nice interactive inworld browser right?

jeroen

On Thursday 17 September 2009 06:31:10 Toni Alatalo wrote:

> Charles Krinke kirjoitti:
> > As far as OpenCroquet, I would encourage folks to find ways for us to
> > interop between OpenSim and OpenCroquet. It would be really cool to be
> > able to view an OpenCroquet space from a prim on an OpenSim region or
> > ideally to be able to step through a gateway some time.
>
> BTW, I wrote a little web server plugin to the Naali (new rex) viewer
> this autumn, to serve live screenshots and perhaps video to outside: to
> a web page, or to be a texture on some object anywhere else. There's a
> screenshot and a link to the source (in viewer trunk) in
> http://wiki.realxtend.org/index.php/Naali_webserver_plugin
>
> So if someone has a spare machine that can keep running a viewer
> connected to some region on e.g. osgrid, we could put a live image e.g.
> on the opensimulator.org web page :) .. Naali doesn't have LOD
> optimizations yet, so for a complex region like Wright Plaza you need a
> powerful gfx card .. but simple regions work on weak cards, even Intel
> integrated etc. (basically anything where Ogre runs, and it runs pretty
> much everywhere). People (e.g. Ryan/sempuki) have now been using Naali
> succesfully on Linux too.
>
> The idea is that by having the web server plugin running inside the
> viewer, it is easy to expose viewer things like controlling the camera
> to some web ui - that's not done yet, feel free to expand, anyone. There
> are some calls for cam and avatar control in the API ready for use, just
> need to add some html buttons to the ui (and I guess ajax would be the
> way). This is not a feature that was planned, but just happened to be
> low hanging fruit 'cause the event framework we've used came with a web
> server too, so I wanted to test it.
>
> Is fun to be able to provide a view, even a controllable one, to anyone
> on the web without any plugins or anything. Limitations of the viewer of
> course apply, like right now you still see every avatar as the viewer
> default avatar, but that's already changing :)
>
> > Charles
>
> ~Toni
>
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > *From:* Olli Aro <[hidden email]>
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:09:19 AM
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
> >
> > Sloodle project also has something similar. Initially that is
> > developed for Second Life (and I have not tested it in OpenSim), but
> > cannot see why it would not also work there.
> >
> >
> >
> > The link to that project is here:
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.sloodle.org/browser/get.php
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> >
> >
> > Olli
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* [hidden email]
> > [mailto:[hidden email]] *On Behalf Of *Fish
> > Kungfu *Sent:* 16 September 2009 12:05
> > *To:* [hidden email]
> > *Subject:* Re: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the display of web
> >
> >
> >
> > Daniel...
> >
> > Glad to hear you are working on this.  I searched the OpenSim email
> > archives and only found one reference to Open Croquet (opencroquet.org
> > <http://opencroquet.org>).  Open Croquet is another 3D world
> > development environment.  The only reason I mention it is because it
> > says on their site they they support in-world web-browsing and I
> > thought you might get some ideas or inspiration by seeing what they've
> > done (without violating their licensing etc).  The in-world web
> > browsing is accomplished via a module called "Croquet Collaborative"
> > (http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Croquet_Collaborative).  Sadly
> > the zip file link didn't work for me.
> >
> > Anyways, I hope this helps some, without sending you on a wild goose
> > chase.  :-)
> >
> > ~~Fish~~
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 2:57 AM, Daniel <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> >
> > At the moment, I'm trying to "expand" the web functionality of OpenSim
> > by integrating a webbrowser control. With the help of that control the
> > user would be able to interact on a webpage displayed on a texture by
> > sending the coordinates of his mouse to that control. Furthermore, an
> > instance of the Internet Explorer running in the background could be
> > used with these coords to manage different user interactions like link
> > forwarding or editing form fields. As a result the updated webpage is
> > rendered with the IElementRenderer to a temporary image file that is
> > send back to the texture in OpenSim.
> >
> > I know that this solution is limited in various ways (and is not
> > compatible with *nix servers) but it is one possibility to go apart
> > from picidae.net <http://picidae.net> and get independent. For me, it
> > is a first step to achieve a separate webbrowser control in OpenSim.
> >
> >
> > -DAniel
> >
> >
> > 2009/9/14 Robert Klein <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> >
> > > > Really? You mean under mono like OpenSim does? Never thought about
> >
> > that and
> >
> > > > I
> > > > did not see any docs about it. Unfortunately that still leaves me
> >
> > with the
> >
> > > > over the top rendering requirements to really do RealXtend justice.
> > > >
> > > > -Robert
> > > >
> > > > Jeroen van Veen wrote:
> > >> > > "I don't want to go the route of realxtend due to it not
> >
> > running on a*nix
> >
> > >> > > server"
> > >> > >
> > >> > > It does run fine on linux servers.  :-)
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Friday 11 September 2009 17:43:05 Robert Klein wrote:
> > >>> > >> Hey Charles,
> > >>> > >> What about being able to display an actual web page in
> >
> > realtime like the
> >
> > >>> > >> realxtend viewer does? I have several of the static "web page
> >
> > on a prim"
> >
> > >>> > >> boards using picidai.net <http://picidai.net> running on my
> >
> > company's internal opensim, but
> >
> > >>> > >>  after playing with the functionality of realxtend.. well
> >
> > what we have
> >
> > > > in
> > > >
> > >>> > >>  opensim does not compare. In this day and age having the
> >
> > ability to at
> >
> > >>> > >>  least view a functioning web page in real time and see it
> >
> > updating is
> >
> > >>> > >>  crucial to business/educational users. Being able to
> >
> > interact with that
> >
> > >>> > >>  web page would be incredible. VNC would be cool too.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> I know there are plenty of work arounds for emulating this
> > > >
> > > > functionality,
> > > >
> > >>> > >>  it would be great to just have it built-in. I don't want to
> >
> > go the
> >
> > > > route
> > > >
> > >>> > >>  of realxtend due to it not running on a*nix server, plus
> >
> > different
> >
> > > > users
> > > >
> > >>> > >>  with different graphics cards get much different experiences.
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Is anyone even working on this kind of functionality in
> >
> > opensim/hippo?
> >
> > >>> > >> -Robert
> > >>> > >>
> > >>> > >> Charles Krinke wrote:
> > >>>> > >> > Well, web pages on a prim are not necessarily a
> >
> > characteristic of the
> >
> > >>>> > >> > client.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > What we have been doing for the last couple of years is
> >
> > displaying web
> >
> > >>>> > >> > pages on prims in OpenSim and using an external helping
> >
> > web site for
> >
> > >>>> > >> > picture formatting such as picidai.net <http://picidai.net>.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > There are a series of prims spread around OSGrid and the
> >
> > OSGrid forums
> >
> > >>>> > >> > have the script source. One of the prims doing web pages
> >
> > on a prim is
> >
> > >>> > >> on
> > >>> > >>
> > >>>> > >> > Wright Plaza and has been working reliably for over a year.
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > Charles
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > ________________________________
> > >>>> > >> > From: Robert Klein <[hidden email]
> >
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> >
> > >>>> > >> > To: [hidden email]
> >
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> >
> > >>>> > >> > Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 7:30:42 AM
> > >>>> > >> > Subject: [Opensim-users] Any plans on supporting the
> >
> > display of web
> >
> > >>>> > >> > pages?
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> >
> > >>>> > >> > I know the realxtend viewer can display web pages on a
> >
> > prim, but what
> >
> > >>>> > >> > about
> > >>>> > >> > support for this in Hippo? Any chance of this happening in
> >
> > the next 3
> >
> > > > -
> > > >
> > >>> > >> 6
> > >>> > >>
> > >>>> > >> > months?
> > >> > >
> > >> > > _______________________________________________
> > >> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > >> > > [hidden email]
> >
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> >
> > >> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > View this message in context:
> >
> > http://n2.nabble.com/Any-plans-on-supporting-the-display-of-web-pages-tp3
> >626144p3638764.html
> >
> > > > Sent from the opensim-users mailing list archive at Nabble.com
> >
> > <http://Nabble.com>.
> >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > > > [hidden email]
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
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