Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

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Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Len W. Brown
Hello everyone,

     I hope my question is in the right place...  I have been on SL for a few years now and am very comfortable with building and terraforming.  I'm just wondering what the state of development is with terraforming in OpenSim.

     I know that in SL when I use the "flatten" preference, the land beneath my mouse flattens perfectly regardless of where I move the mouse unless the land is baked along an incline.

     In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21" or such to flatten the entire region.

     I've been hoping there would be some improvement in the terraforming tools over the last few revisions but they seem to have remained stagnant.

     Otherwise I have been very happily running 25 regions on my home server for the last few months and have really been pleased with all the other improvements that have come along.

Thanks for input!

- Len W. Brown

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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Lúthien Athariel
hi Len,

I have been having some problems there too - mostly near the seams where regions meet. I've understood that the terraforming tools have a bit of a problem dealing with those - and I discovered that a good way to get flat land is to first select an area, choose "flatten land", and click the "Apply to Selection" (or whatever the exact name is) button a couple of times .. that usually works fine.

For larger and more complex edits, the terraforming tools are not too wel suited in my opinion. What I do is to export the terrain file(s) as a .R32 file: if you install the terrain-tools there is a very convenient tool that lets you export either the whole thing, or a subset of regions. You can then edit them in (the free version of) L3DT: import as height map, and use the 3D terrain editor in there. You have to enter the total X and Y pixels for your terrain (256 per region) and a value for the height (I use 1.5, which comes down to approximately the same visual size as it renders in opensim) - although that height setting is only important for the rendering in L3DT itself.

Within L3DT there is a number of interesting terraforming tools like avalanches (which creates a very realistic erosion effect), cliffs, a bulldozer with which you can create things like rivers, canals or dykes, several smoothing options etcetera. Export the height map again as a .R32 file, and import again in opensim with the terrain-tools function.
The finer details that L3DT produces, however, seem not to render in OpenSim - probably because the terrain is not resolved to that level of detail. But some sculpted prim - built boulders and rocks can take care of that. 

It works pretty good, I have used this route a lot.

BTW - L3DT is windows only - but I found that it works like a charm under Crossover in OSX (and thus, probably in linux as well)

- luthien

2009/5/27 Len Brown <[hidden email]>
Hello everyone,

     I hope my question is in the right place...  I have been on SL for a few years now and am very comfortable with building and terraforming.  I'm just wondering what the state of development is with terraforming in OpenSim.

     I know that in SL when I use the "flatten" preference, the land beneath my mouse flattens perfectly regardless of where I move the mouse unless the land is baked along an incline.

     In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21" or such to flatten the entire region.

     I've been hoping there would be some improvement in the terraforming tools over the last few revisions but they seem to have remained stagnant.

     Otherwise I have been very happily running 25 regions on my home server for the last few months and have really been pleased with all the other improvements that have come along.

Thanks for input!

- Len W. Brown

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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Len W. Brown
Lúthien,
 
     Thank you for your response!  I appreciate the information and I'll give that a try for the time being.  It's always a good idea to try new tools.  As the old saying goes, necessity is the mother of invention...
 
- Len W. Brown

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 5:25 AM, Lúthien Athariel <[hidden email]> wrote:
hi Len,

I have been having some problems there too - mostly near the seams where regions meet. I've understood that the terraforming tools have a bit of a problem dealing with those - and I discovered that a good way to get flat land is to first select an area, choose "flatten land", and click the "Apply to Selection" (or whatever the exact name is) button a couple of times .. that usually works fine.

For larger and more complex edits, the terraforming tools are not too wel suited in my opinion. What I do is to export the terrain file(s) as a .R32 file: if you install the terrain-tools there is a very convenient tool that lets you export either the whole thing, or a subset of regions. You can then edit them in (the free version of) L3DT: import as height map, and use the 3D terrain editor in there. You have to enter the total X and Y pixels for your terrain (256 per region) and a value for the height (I use 1.5, which comes down to approximately the same visual size as it renders in opensim) - although that height setting is only important for the rendering in L3DT itself.

Within L3DT there is a number of interesting terraforming tools like avalanches (which creates a very realistic erosion effect), cliffs, a bulldozer with which you can create things like rivers, canals or dykes, several smoothing options etcetera. Export the height map again as a .R32 file, and import again in opensim with the terrain-tools function.
The finer details that L3DT produces, however, seem not to render in OpenSim - probably because the terrain is not resolved to that level of detail. But some sculpted prim - built boulders and rocks can take care of that. 

It works pretty good, I have used this route a lot.

BTW - L3DT is windows only - but I found that it works like a charm under Crossover in OSX (and thus, probably in linux as well)

- luthien

2009/5/27 Len Brown <[hidden email]>
Hello everyone,

     I hope my question is in the right place...  I have been on SL for a few years now and am very comfortable with building and terraforming.  I'm just wondering what the state of development is with terraforming in OpenSim.

     I know that in SL when I use the "flatten" preference, the land beneath my mouse flattens perfectly regardless of where I move the mouse unless the land is baked along an incline.

     In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21" or such to flatten the entire region.

     I've been hoping there would be some improvement in the terraforming tools over the last few revisions but they seem to have remained stagnant.

     Otherwise I have been very happily running 25 regions on my home server for the last few months and have really been pleased with all the other improvements that have come along.

Thanks for input!

- Len W. Brown

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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

trucker.anthony
type in the opensim.exe console

change region (region name)


then type

terrain fill 21



that bring the land completely flat and touching at borders you can also
type 'help' in the console to get a list of commands and 'terrain help' for
a list of terrain commands is way easier than using L3DT for that specific
task.
TA




On Wed, 27 May 2009 13:46:05 -0500, Len Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Lúthien,
>
>      Thank you for your response!  I appreciate the information and I'll
> give that a try for the time being.  It's always a good idea to try new
> tools.  As the old saying goes, necessity is the mother of invention...
>
> - Len W. Brown
>
> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 5:25 AM, Lúthien Athariel <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> hi Len,
>>
>> I have been having some problems there too - mostly near the seams where
>> regions meet. I've understood that the terraforming tools have a bit of
a
>> problem dealing with those - and I discovered that a good way to get
flat
>> land is to first select an area, choose "flatten land", and click the
>> "Apply
>> to Selection" (or whatever the exact name is) button a couple of times
..
>> that usually works fine.
>>
>> For larger and more complex edits, the terraforming tools are not too
wel

>> suited in my opinion. What I do is to export the terrain file(s) as a
>> .R32
>> file: if you install the terrain-tools there is a very convenient tool
>> that
>> lets you export either the whole thing, or a subset of regions. You can
>> then
>> edit them in (the free version of) L3DT: import as height map, and use
>> the
>> 3D terrain editor in there. You have to enter the total X and Y pixels
>> for
>> your terrain (256 per region) and a value for the height (I use 1.5,
>> which
>> comes down to approximately the same visual size as it renders in
>> opensim) -
>> although that height setting is only important for the rendering in L3DT
>> itself.
>>
>> Within L3DT there is a number of interesting terraforming tools like
>> avalanches (which creates a very realistic erosion effect), cliffs, a
>> bulldozer with which you can create things like rivers, canals or dykes,
>> several smoothing options etcetera. Export the height map again as a
.R32

>> file, and import again in opensim with the terrain-tools function.
>> The finer details that L3DT produces, however, seem not to render in
>> OpenSim - probably because the terrain is not resolved to that level of
>> detail. But some sculpted prim - built boulders and rocks can take care
>> of
>> that.
>>
>> It works pretty good, I have used this route a lot.
>>
>> BTW - L3DT is windows only - but I found that it works like a charm
under

>> Crossover in OSX (and thus, probably in linux as well)
>>
>> - luthien
>>
>> 2009/5/27 Len Brown <[hidden email]>
>>
>>>  Hello everyone,
>>>
>>>      I hope my question is in the right place...  I have been on SL for
>>>      a
>>> few years now and am very comfortable with building and terraforming.
>>> I'm
>>> just wondering what the state of development is with terraforming in
>>> OpenSim.
>>>
>>>      I know that in SL when I use the "flatten" preference, the land
>>> beneath my mouse flattens perfectly regardless of where I move the
mouse
>>> unless the land is baked along an incline.
>>>
>>>      In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way
>>>      to
>>> get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21" or such
to
>>> flatten the entire region.
>>>
>>>      I've been hoping there would be some improvement in the
>>>      terraforming
>>> tools over the last few revisions but they seem to have remained
>>> stagnant.
>>>
>>>      Otherwise I have been very happily running 25 regions on my home
>>> server for the last few months and have really been pleased with all
the

>>> other improvements that have come along.
>>>
>>> Thanks for input!
>>>
>>> - Len W. Brown
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>
>>
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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Lúthien Athariel
hi,

"terrain fill 21" is indeed a lot easier - but I concluded that  
flattening an entire region was not what he was looking for - given  
the fact that he mentioned that in his original post (see below)

selecting a rectangle with the build tools and then flattening (and  
subsequently lowering or raising) also works fine - though you cannot  
cross region borders then, and are limited to a rectangular shape. I  
found that when patching some rectangles together to get the wanted  
shape and getting them to meet when they cross a region border is  
usually more hassle than going via L3DT.


- luthien

On 28-May-09, at 5:24 AM, <[hidden email]> <[hidden email]
 > wrote:

> type in the opensim.exe console
> change region (region name)
> then type
> terrain fill 21
>
>>>>
>>>> In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way
>>>> to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21"  
>>>> or such to
>>>> flatten the entire region.
>>>> [...]
>>>> - Len W. Brown
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>
>>>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users

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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Dirk Krause
Just to mention it: you *can* export raw terrain files from Second Life and import them into OpenSim without a problem, if it's easier to terraform in SL (which I wasn't aware of).

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Lúthien Athariel
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 28. Mai 2009 09:10
An: [hidden email]
Betreff: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

hi,

"terrain fill 21" is indeed a lot easier - but I concluded that  
flattening an entire region was not what he was looking for - given  
the fact that he mentioned that in his original post (see below)

selecting a rectangle with the build tools and then flattening (and  
subsequently lowering or raising) also works fine - though you cannot  
cross region borders then, and are limited to a rectangular shape. I  
found that when patching some rectangles together to get the wanted  
shape and getting them to meet when they cross a region border is  
usually more hassle than going via L3DT.


- luthien

On 28-May-09, at 5:24 AM, <[hidden email]> <[hidden email]
 > wrote:

> type in the opensim.exe console
> change region (region name)
> then type
> terrain fill 21
>
>>>>
>>>> In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way
>>>> to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21"  
>>>> or such to
>>>> flatten the entire region.
>>>> [...]
>>>> - Len W. Brown
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>
>>>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users

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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Ethan Gardener
I find OpenSim's flatten land much less useful than SL's. OpenSim flattens to some kind of average height, which is not predictable, where SL picks the terrain height at the point you click to start flattening. In OpenSim I have to use a prim with a script looping over llFlattenLand or some such. The script is actually a bit more useful than SL's flatten land tool as the land height can be set by number.

On Thu, 28 May 2009 10:06:51 +0200
"Dirk Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Just to mention it: you *can* export raw terrain files from Second Life and import them into OpenSim without a problem, if it's easier to terraform in SL (which I wasn't aware of).
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Lúthien Athariel
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 28. Mai 2009 09:10
> An: [hidden email]
> Betreff: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development
>
> hi,
>
> "terrain fill 21" is indeed a lot easier - but I concluded that  
> flattening an entire region was not what he was looking for - given  
> the fact that he mentioned that in his original post (see below)
>
> selecting a rectangle with the build tools and then flattening (and  
> subsequently lowering or raising) also works fine - though you cannot  
> cross region borders then, and are limited to a rectangular shape. I  
> found that when patching some rectangles together to get the wanted  
> shape and getting them to meet when they cross a region border is  
> usually more hassle than going via L3DT.
>
>
> - luthien
>
> On 28-May-09, at 5:24 AM, <[hidden email]> <[hidden email]
>  > wrote:
>
> > type in the opensim.exe console
> > change region (region name)
> > then type
> > terrain fill 21
> >
> >>>>
> >>>> In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no way
> >>>> to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21"  
> >>>> or such to
> >>>> flatten the entire region.
> >>>> [...]
> >>>> - Len W. Brown
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Opensim-users mailing list
> >>>> [hidden email]
> >>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Opensim-users mailing list
> >>> [hidden email]
> >>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >>>
> >>>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users


--
Ethan Grammatikidis
The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne. -- Chaucer
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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Frisby, Adam
Interesting,

I wasn't sure how the SL version worked exactly, so the flatten I wrote uses the median for the selection. I might see if I can implement the SL version, should be easy enough.

Adam

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
> [hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ethan Grammatikidis
> Sent: Thursday, 28 May 2009 5:33 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of
> Development
>
> I find OpenSim's flatten land much less useful than SL's. OpenSim
> flattens to some kind of average height, which is not predictable,
> where SL picks the terrain height at the point you click to start
> flattening. In OpenSim I have to use a prim with a script looping over
> llFlattenLand or some such. The script is actually a bit more useful
> than SL's flatten land tool as the land height can be set by number.
>
> On Thu, 28 May 2009 10:06:51 +0200
> "Dirk Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Just to mention it: you *can* export raw terrain files from Second
> Life and import them into OpenSim without a problem, if it's easier to
> terraform in SL (which I wasn't aware of).
> >
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
> [hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Lúthien Athariel
> > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 28. Mai 2009 09:10
> > An: [hidden email]
> > Betreff: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of
> Development
> >
> > hi,
> >
> > "terrain fill 21" is indeed a lot easier - but I concluded that
> > flattening an entire region was not what he was looking for - given
> > the fact that he mentioned that in his original post (see below)
> >
> > selecting a rectangle with the build tools and then flattening (and
> > subsequently lowering or raising) also works fine - though you cannot
> > cross region borders then, and are limited to a rectangular shape. I
> > found that when patching some rectangles together to get the wanted
> > shape and getting them to meet when they cross a region border is
> > usually more hassle than going via L3DT.
> >
> >
> > - luthien
> >
> > On 28-May-09, at 5:24 AM, <[hidden email]>
> <[hidden email]
> >  > wrote:
> >
> > > type in the opensim.exe console
> > > change region (region name)
> > > then type
> > > terrain fill 21
> > >
> > >>>>
> > >>>> In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no
> way
> > >>>> to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21"
> > >>>> or such to
> > >>>> flatten the entire region.
> > >>>> [...]
> > >>>> - Len W. Brown
> > >>>>
> > >>>> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> Opensim-users mailing list
> > >>>> [hidden email]
> > >>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>> _______________________________________________
> > >>> Opensim-users mailing list
> > >>> [hidden email]
> > >>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Opensim-users mailing list
> > > [hidden email]
> > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
> > _______________________________________________
> > Opensim-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
>
> --
> Ethan Grammatikidis
> The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne. -- Chaucer
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
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Re: Terraforming in OpenSim - State of Development

Brent Seidel-3
Hi Adam,

I just downloaded and tested SVN r9710 which has the new flatten  
brush, among other things.  After some brief testing to make sure  
that things didn't immediately crash, I found some jumbled terrain  
that I wanted to be smoother.  The previous flatten wouldn't smooth  
it, so I tried the new flatten.  The results were spectacular.  I've  
included a snapshot of my avatar looking at the crater of where the  
land used to be.


I did another test raising some land from the sea bottom.  Even with  
the strength set very low, flatten rapidly squashed fairly high  
mountains.

In other, fairly brief, testing, I was able to fly around through my  
9 regions without anything appearing too broken.

My configuration:
Running standalone with 9 regions, usually only 1 avatar
Mono 2.4
Centos 5.2 (8 core Xeon 64 bit with 8 gigs)
NHibernate with PostgreSQL

brent

On 28-May-2009, at 8:19 AM, Frisby, Adam wrote:

> Interesting,
>
> I wasn't sure how the SL version worked exactly, so the flatten I  
> wrote uses the median for the selection. I might see if I can  
> implement the SL version, should be easy enough.
>
> Adam
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
>> [hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ethan Grammatikidis
>> Sent: Thursday, 28 May 2009 5:33 AM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of
>> Development
>>
>> I find OpenSim's flatten land much less useful than SL's. OpenSim
>> flattens to some kind of average height, which is not predictable,
>> where SL picks the terrain height at the point you click to start
>> flattening. In OpenSim I have to use a prim with a script looping  
>> over
>> llFlattenLand or some such. The script is actually a bit more useful
>> than SL's flatten land tool as the land height can be set by number.
>>
>> On Thu, 28 May 2009 10:06:51 +0200
>> "Dirk Krause" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> Just to mention it: you *can* export raw terrain files from Second
>> Life and import them into OpenSim without a problem, if it's  
>> easier to
>> terraform in SL (which I wasn't aware of).
>>>
>>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>> Von: [hidden email] [mailto:opensim-users-
>> [hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Lúthien Athariel
>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 28. Mai 2009 09:10
>>> An: [hidden email]
>>> Betreff: Re: [Opensim-users] Terraforming in OpenSim - State of
>> Development
>>>
>>> hi,
>>>
>>> "terrain fill 21" is indeed a lot easier - but I concluded that
>>> flattening an entire region was not what he was looking for - given
>>> the fact that he mentioned that in his original post (see below)
>>>
>>> selecting a rectangle with the build tools and then flattening (and
>>> subsequently lowering or raising) also works fine - though you  
>>> cannot
>>> cross region borders then, and are limited to a rectangular shape. I
>>> found that when patching some rectangles together to get the wanted
>>> shape and getting them to meet when they cross a region border is
>>> usually more hassle than going via L3DT.
>>>
>>>
>>> - luthien
>>>
>>> On 28-May-09, at 5:24 AM, <[hidden email]>
>> <[hidden email]
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> type in the opensim.exe console
>>>> change region (region name)
>>>> then type
>>>> terrain fill 21
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In OpenSim the flatten command is very loose, and there is no
>> way
>>>>>>> to get perfectly flat land aside from entering "terrain fill 21"
>>>>>>> or such to
>>>>>>> flatten the entire region.
>>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>> - Len W. Brown
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>
>> --
>> Ethan Grammatikidis
>> The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne. -- Chaucer
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