are there better landscaping tools?

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are there better landscaping tools?

Serendipity Seraph
I am on 0.7.0.2 but have seen similar behavior for several releases.  The standard landscaping tools seem really rough.  For instance, attempting to lower a small are I selected caused adjacent areas to go all spiky.  Applying flat to them seemed to make the ground do this weird bubbly dance. I have tried various strength and size settings to little avail.  What I am trying to do is to create a pretty much round 30 m or so pool on the land.  The edges don't have to be perfect as I have a set of round marble surrounding steps.  Pretty when it works.  It isn't so bad to do this in SL.   But I am having a devil of a time getting the landscaping just right in OpenSim.   Are there better brushes or some tricks of the trade short of building a terrain map in Photoshop or something?    I also use a Space Navigator in my setup.  Don't know if that would make landscaping act worse or not.  Doesn't seem to make much difference when I turn it off.

- seren

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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Teravus Ovares
I generally don't have an issue in 1x viewers when working with terrain.  I have not tried doing a complex terrain setup with 2x viewers yet.

The only thing that I've found is be careful around the edges.    The edges can sometimes cause an edge case that makes the terrain spiky.

There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right settings. (http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Using_L3DT)

-Teravus

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 5:04 AM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:
I am on 0.7.0.2 but have seen similar behavior for several releases.  The standard landscaping tools seem really rough.  For instance, attempting to lower a small are I selected caused adjacent areas to go all spiky.  Applying flat to them seemed to make the ground do this weird bubbly dance. I have tried various strength and size settings to little avail.  What I am trying to do is to create a pretty much round 30 m or so pool on the land.  The edges don't have to be perfect as I have a set of round marble surrounding steps.  Pretty when it works.  It isn't so bad to do this in SL.   But I am having a devil of a time getting the landscaping just right in OpenSim.   Are there better brushes or some tricks of the trade short of building a terrain map in Photoshop or something?    I also use a Space Navigator in my setup.  Don't know if that would make landscaping act worse or not.  Doesn't seem to make much difference when I turn it off.

- seren

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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Dave Coyle-2
On 10/12/10 8:45 AM, Teravus Ovares wrote:
> There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right settings.

There's also World Machine:

        http://www.world-machine.com/

-coyled
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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Serendipity Seraph
In reply to this post by Teravus Ovares

On Oct 12, 2010, at 5:45 AM, Teravus Ovares wrote:

I generally don't have an issue in 1x viewers when working with terrain.  I have not tried doing a complex terrain setup with 2x viewers yet.

This is a 1x viewer issue, I should have mentioned.  Also I am working in the middle of the root region of a 3x3 mega-region.  I have seen it on every viewer when attempting to do this task in OpenSim (mainly diva distributions).  Have you tried this type of task?  


The only thing that I've found is be careful around the edges.    The edges can sometimes cause an edge case that makes the terrain spiky.


I presume you mean edge of region?  

There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right settings. (http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Using_L3DT)

Can that handle megaregions?  Will play with it and find out.  Thanks for the tip.

- seren


-Teravus

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 5:04 AM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:
I am on 0.7.0.2 but have seen similar behavior for several releases.  The standard landscaping tools seem really rough.  For instance, attempting to lower a small are I selected caused adjacent areas to go all spiky.  Applying flat to them seemed to make the ground do this weird bubbly dance. I have tried various strength and size settings to little avail.  What I am trying to do is to create a pretty much round 30 m or so pool on the land.  The edges don't have to be perfect as I have a set of round marble surrounding steps.  Pretty when it works.  It isn't so bad to do this in SL.   But I am having a devil of a time getting the landscaping just right in OpenSim.   Are there better brushes or some tricks of the trade short of building a terrain map in Photoshop or something?    I also use a Space Navigator in my setup.  Don't know if that would make landscaping act worse or not.  Doesn't seem to make much difference when I turn it off.

- seren

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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Ken Grunke
For me, the viewer landforming tools do a close approximation at best,
so I generally save a terrain image to disk and edit in the Gimp. You
can edit, reload in the console and check, going back and forth.

Making a simple hole and applying gaussian blur to soften the edges
could only take 5 minutes. In Gimp, the HSV values are roughly
equivalent to meter height from zero. Those are in the color picker
(Hue, Saturation, and Value) I assume Photoshop has the same or
similar.

 If you edit a RGB file you need to flatten the image and save as a
greyscale to make it 8-bit which is
necessary for a terrain file.

Doing a gaussian blur to the entire image is usually a good idea after
using the inworld terrain tools, it smooths it all out nicely.

Ken aka Key

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 3:58 PM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On Oct 12, 2010, at 5:45 AM, Teravus Ovares wrote:
>
> I generally don't have an issue in 1x viewers when working with terrain.  I
> have not tried doing a complex terrain setup with 2x viewers yet.
>
> This is a 1x viewer issue, I should have mentioned.  Also I am working in
> the middle of the root region of a 3x3 mega-region.  I have seen it on every
> viewer when attempting to do this task in OpenSim (mainly diva
> distributions).  Have you tried this type of task?
>
> The only thing that I've found is be careful around the edges.    The edges
> can sometimes cause an edge case that makes the terrain spiky.
>
>
> I presume you mean edge of region?
>
> There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right settings.
> (http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Using_L3DT)
>
> Can that handle megaregions?  Will play with it and find out.  Thanks for
> the tip.
> - seren
>
> -Teravus
>
> On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 5:04 AM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I am on 0.7.0.2 but have seen similar behavior for several releases.  The
>> standard landscaping tools seem really rough.  For instance, attempting to
>> lower a small are I selected caused adjacent areas to go all spiky.
>>  Applying flat to them seemed to make the ground do this weird bubbly dance.
>> I have tried various strength and size settings to little avail.  What I am
>> trying to do is to create a pretty much round 30 m or so pool on the land.
>>  The edges don't have to be perfect as I have a set of round marble
>> surrounding steps.  Pretty when it works.  It isn't so bad to do this in SL.
>>   But I am having a devil of a time getting the landscaping just right in
>> OpenSim.   Are there better brushes or some tricks of the trade short of
>> building a terrain map in Photoshop or something?    I also use a Space
>> Navigator in my setup.  Don't know if that would make landscaping act worse
>> or not.  Doesn't seem to make much difference when I turn it off.
>>
>> - seren
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
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> [hidden email]
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>
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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Shaun T. Erickson
On 10/12/10 7:10 PM, Ken G. wrote:

> For me, the viewer landforming tools do a close approximation at best,
> so I generally save a terrain image to disk and edit in the Gimp. You
> can edit, reload in the console and check, going back and forth.
>
> Making a simple hole and applying gaussian blur to soften the edges
> could only take 5 minutes. In Gimp, the HSV values are roughly
> equivalent to meter height from zero. Those are in the color picker
> (Hue, Saturation, and Value) I assume Photoshop has the same or
> similar.
>
>   If you edit a RGB file you need to flatten the image and save as a
> greyscale to make it 8-bit which is
> necessary for a terrain file.
>
> Doing a gaussian blur to the entire image is usually a good idea after
> using the inworld terrain tools, it smooths it all out nicely.

That's not so simple when your terrain map is split up into twenty tiles
to cover 20 adjoining regions and all those edges have to perfectly
align when you are done, so that it still looks like one, perfect,
unbroken terrain.

-ste (aka smxy)
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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Teravus Ovares
In reply to this post by Serendipity Seraph
The root region shouldn't have too many issues.    When you're modifying the root region you should get updates relatively quickly.  If you're modifying one of the 'fake' region terrains, there can sometimes be a noticeable delay in the results.


You presume correctly.  Using certain tools on the edges of the regions (this includes fake regions) can sometimes cause irreparable pits and spikes that spread across the terrain as you modify it.   Smooth, is one that I can think of that does that if you're not careful.


Yes, it can handle megaregions.   There's a tutorial for megaregions on the web searchable with google.

The key is to split up the large terrain into smaller chunks in L3DT.   Then load the individual chunks into the regions using the console commands

change region "region name"
terrain load <filename01>
change region "region name"
terrain load <filename10>
...  etc..

-Teravus


On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 4:58 PM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Oct 12, 2010, at 5:45 AM, Teravus Ovares wrote:

I generally don't have an issue in 1x viewers when working with terrain.  I have not tried doing a complex terrain setup with 2x viewers yet.

This is a 1x viewer issue, I should have mentioned.  Also I am working in the middle of the root region of a 3x3 mega-region.  I have seen it on every viewer when attempting to do this task in OpenSim (mainly diva distributions).  Have you tried this type of task?  


The only thing that I've found is be careful around the edges.    The edges can sometimes cause an edge case that makes the terrain spiky.


I presume you mean edge of region?  

There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right settings. (http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Using_L3DT)

Can that handle megaregions?  Will play with it and find out.  Thanks for the tip.

- seren


-Teravus

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 5:04 AM, Serendipity Seraph <[hidden email]> wrote:
I am on 0.7.0.2 but have seen similar behavior for several releases.  The standard landscaping tools seem really rough.  For instance, attempting to lower a small are I selected caused adjacent areas to go all spiky.  Applying flat to them seemed to make the ground do this weird bubbly dance. I have tried various strength and size settings to little avail.  What I am trying to do is to create a pretty much round 30 m or so pool on the land.  The edges don't have to be perfect as I have a set of round marble surrounding steps.  Pretty when it works.  It isn't so bad to do this in SL.   But I am having a devil of a time getting the landscaping just right in OpenSim.   Are there better brushes or some tricks of the trade short of building a terrain map in Photoshop or something?    I also use a Space Navigator in my setup.  Don't know if that would make landscaping act worse or not.  Doesn't seem to make much difference when I turn it off.

- seren

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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Villano, Paul Mr CIV USA TRADOC
In reply to this post by Dave Coyle-2
If you can afford World Machine I guess you aren't griping about price hikes in SL.  Yikes!  But the mention of Terragen did bring back good memories.  I was an early adapter and can still remember oohing and ahhing about it.  And it was free. No clue about virtual worlds at that time but just seeing and using it was exciting. :o)

----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Coyle <[hidden email]>
Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 16:49
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] are there better landscaping tools?
To: [hidden email]


> On 10/12/10 8:45 AM, Teravus Ovares wrote:
> > There's also the L3DT and TerraGen if you save with the right
> settings.
> There's also World Machine:
>
> http://www.world-machine.com/
>
> -coyled
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
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Re: are there better landscaping tools?

Arielle_P
In reply to this post by Serendipity Seraph
I have had similar issues  landscaping megaregions in world. The solution for me is to change combinecontiguousregions=true to false while i do the landscaping. It is much more behaved. Once I am finished changing the terrain, I restart the mega with the setting turned back to true.